Motion 16 Continued and a Point of Order
Ms Blakeman:
Thanks very much, Mr. Speaker. I have a couple of questions for the Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake. She seems very, very plugged into the government policy, so I’m sure she’ll have the answers to this. Can she give me a subtotal of all of the wish lists that we’ve heard described over the last couple of days? There’s highway 55 in her constituency. Then later she talked about housing for seniors.
I heard the Member for Edmonton-Ellerslie talking about schools. I heard the Member for Red Deer-North talking about seniors’ housing. Obviously, there’s a great wish list, and I’m just wondering if there’s a subtotal somewhere that I could be let in on the amount. That’s question 1.
My second question is that this motion is about creating debt. It’s about setting up a system so the province can borrow money to do something. And my compliments to the Public Affairs Bureau. I have to say that everything I’ve heard has been consistent in the messaging of allowing Albertans to share and wonderful phrases about how they can invest and they can drive by a highway and go: I am so proud of my piece of this highway.
I guess my question is: is there an understanding that this is about creating debt? Do you understand that this motion is about going into debt and that not all Albertans will be buying a capital bond? All Albertans are taxpayers and will be sharing ultimately in the debt that’s created. So if this government sells a billion dollars’ worth of bonds, we have to pay that money back to those people with interest, which creates a debt for every Albertan because that’s where the money comes from.
Do you understand that this is about debt rather than flowery phrases about a few people that can afford to invest and buy a bond? I’m not clear on that, so maybe you can help me understand that. Let’s just go with those two questions for now. She’s so plugged in, I know she’ll know.
[interjections]
The Speaker:
Sorry. We’re going to talk through the chair.
Hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake, do you wish to respond?
Mrs. Leskiw:
No.
Mr. Snelgrove:
Hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake, I would wonder if she would be aware of the difference between an investment and an asset in the future of Alberta and debt or, because apparently some don’t, if she would know the difference between appropriate use of public borrowing as defined by just about every democracy and country in the world right now and gibberish or if she thinks that there’s a future for her constituency in an Alberta that’s prosperous and forward looking.
Ms Blakeman:
Point of order, Mr. Speaker.
The Speaker:
Okay. Stop the clock at 1:57. We’re dealing with a point of order now.
The hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre.
Point of Order
Allegations against a Member
Ms Blakeman:
Thank you so much, Mr. Speaker. Well, it’s just interesting that I’ve heard so much in the last couple of days about respectful give-and-take of ideas, and then we have ministers of the Crown who should be respected ministers of the Crown who get up and make statements which are truly casting aspersions. Under 23(h), (i), and (j), which are all about saying unnecessarily nasty things to characterize other people, which we just didn’t need in this debate – the minister could have controlled himself, but he just couldn’t.
He had to get in there and say an allegation against another member. With the hand gesture he was certainly indicating this member because there’s no one else on this end that it could possibly be at this time. I don’t think it’s a motive to say that anything that I was referring to was gibberish, but it was certainly using “abusive or insulting language of a nature likely to create disorder.”
I would ask that the member withdraw that. I mean, I’m more than willing to engage in the debate. If the member had listened to what I’d been saying, I clearly outlined the case for borrowing for capital projects, so clearly I do understand it. I’m asking the minister to contribute to some good give-and-take in this Assembly, to encourage a good give-and-take and respect between the two sides of this House, and withdraw his comment. Thank you.
The Speaker:
No. We’re not going any further. It’s 11 minutes after 4 on the fourth day of the first week, and the chair is going to deal with this matter right now. Two segments ago under the Q and A – part of the Q and A is to deal with policy questions and debating questions – the chair almost intervened when the hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar personally went after the hon. Minister of Education over his budget, which has absolutely nothing to do with the debate that we had.
But the chair didn’t. The hon. Government House Leader responded, and it was dealt with. The hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre, you turned around on at least two or three occasions and looked directly at the hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake and said, “Do you understand?” Boy, if that isn’t suggestive in a lot of ways that could lead to a lot of violations of 23(h), (i), and (j) – but the hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake did not.
Then the hon. President of the Treasury Board got up and, for whatever machismo or honourable reason, in order to defend the hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake, used the word gibberish. Well, okay. Gibberish is not a word that we’ve ever ruled out to be inoffensive in the past.
So I’m just saying that it’s not a point of order. We’re going back. We’ve got one minute and 57 seconds in this Q and A. If anybody wants to raise a question with respect to the submission made by the hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake, please prepare to do it, but we’re dealing with policy things. We’re not putting down people, and we’re not being suggestive that somebody who says something in this House is ignorant or does not know what they’re talking about. That is wrong, and there’s no more issue on this issue. There is no issue. No. I’m not going forward on this; 1:57 left. Okay.
Ms Blakeman:
Well, under 13(2) I’m allowed to ask the Speaker to explain.
The Speaker:
I just did. I said the matter is over. Do you want to participate in the Q and A side?
Ms Blakeman:
Yes.
The Speaker:
There’s 1:57 left. Proceed through the chair.
Ms Blakeman:
I have a question. I’m wondering, given the statements that I heard the Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake make, if she does understand the difference between creating debt and offering something . . .
The Speaker:
Please sit down. If we want to have a debate on semantics, you can have a debate on semantics. But I think that for the most part people do not attack one another personally.
Ms Blakeman:
It’s not an attack. It’s a question.
The Speaker:
Well, hon. member, please. Just listen to yourself. Just listen to yourself.
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